yutio888 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 21, 2022 8:13 pmYou cannot be dispersed by most means when you're in Time Prison in 1.7.4, and you can try with Time Prison + Disperse Magic, or other combos in debug mode or using adventurer. You can also check https://git.net-core.org/tome/t-engine4 ... .lua#L7291 for detail. In short, now it is impossible for many disperse talents to work against invulnerable targets.
Thanks for this information, I am not aware of all of the recent changes.
Still, there are multiple talents that can remove your effects, even while you are Time Prisoned. Several talents are not :dispel, but instead :removeEffect.
Some examples:
1., Twist the Knife: if you have any magical debuff, this talent will remove that many magical effects from you. 7 classes have this talent from the total 33 classes.
2., Disintegration: Paradox Mage have this (and btw, PMs can also Time Prison you).
3., Sunder Armour: several enemy basetypes have this talent, including some very common ones too: Champion of Urh’Rok, Naga Myrmidon, MINOTAUR (even summoned ones), ORC SOLDIER.
Sunder Armour can remove ANY shield effect from you, even Time Shield / Temporal Shield, or Stormshield. And this is a :removeEffect, so it even removes them under Time Prison.
4., Shattering Blow: same as Sunder Armour, Berserkers have this.
5., Switch: Cultists have this talent. It basically removes all your beneficial effects (except Temporal Shield) and it has only a 7 turn cooldown. Under Time Prison, it will just set all of your effects’ durations to 0, because after the duration reduction, it is a :dispel effect. (So, you will lose all your effects anyway).
So, 10 classes from the 33 and some very common basetypes can still remove your effects even under Time Prison.
You can be also Mana Clashed, Acid Fired, Anti Magic Zoned or just Arcane Resource burned from attacks, so all your mana can be also deleted.
Btw, these 10 classes (and basetypes) can also remove your effects and Shields, if you are not Time Prisoned.
Mindslayers can remove any non-other shield effect from you with Impale (but this is a :dispel effect, so it’s not working under Time Prison).
If a Writhing One is rolling Overgrowth, you can be immediately dead, especially if the dude
has extra global speed / movement speed (even just from a Movement Infusion).
You will be quaked away totally randomly, even 20-30 tiles away sometimes per turn.
Overgrowth is destroying also your Stone Walls, while you are inside, by "quaking" them and placing them (and you) randomly.
So activating Stone Wall when you are in danger is totally unsafe, if a Writhing One is inside your Hunted radius or already targeting you.
Arcane Blade, Shadowblades, Archmages have Displacement Shield, and Paradox Mage can also trigger it. This is a hit, so bypasses resilience.
Paradox Mages, Temporal Wardens have Webs of Fate even with ~45% damage displacement.
If you do not inspect them and just keep dealing damage, you can be easily in a bad situation.
Paradox Mages can teleport you, even if you have 100% teleport immunity.
Paradox Mages can also Time Prison you, not just Archmages, Shadowblades.
With Shadow's Path, a Doomed can nuke you even through walls, and this is multiple damage instances (per shadow).
Anorithils, Solipsists can clone you, and this can be very bad because your clone can disperse you.
Wyrmics, Reavers, Corruptors, Doombringers, Cursed, Doomed can apply very high cooldown increase effect on you.
E.g. Burning Hex can reach ~300+% in late-game, so x4 all your cooldowns.
You do not consider having all your talents’ cooldowns multiplied with 3-4 dangerous?
Having even 1 of these effects can be lethal if you cannot clear it for a few turns.
Your only detrimental effect management is 1 or 2 Shatter Afflictions Rune.
This is very few on madness.
In your guide, you are suggesting to use only 1 Shatter Afflictions Rune.
When you get a 50% Confusion for 15 turns, you are clearing it with Shatter. Then you get a Burning Hex...
You are using Circle of Sanctity.
Psyshots have Psionic Mirror, so they can Silence you for 3 turns by giving you the effect.
This is bypassing silence immunity totally.
Do you aware: any Chronomancer enemy can have the Speed Control tree (except Time Stop)? These talents have no random_boss_rarity.
(I will use eff. level 40 talents now, these are not end-game levels on enemies)
Haste is giving 96% global speed bonus for 7-10 turns, with a 24 turn cooldown.
Celerity is giving 96% x 3 = 288% movement speed bonus passively.
Time Dilation is giving 48% x 3 = 144% attack, mind and spell speed bonus passively.
So Speed Control tree synergies well with every other class that a unique/randboss enemy rolls, it gives ALL speeds.
Any boss/unique who rolls Temporal Warden or Paradox Mage, can have 200% global speed AND 388% movement speed
AND 244% action speeds (so ~40% of a turn action speeds).
What do you think, what can a Temporal Warden + Cursed or a TW + Bulwark do?
Several classes have multiple multi-attack talents, the Shield Offense tree is very common.
They can deal even ~9000 damage to you in 1 turn AFTER RESILIENCE.
And I did not added Blinding Speed so far because it has random_boss_rarity.
Do you aware: Mindslayers have Skate for movement speed and Quick as Thought for Global speed buff?
Skate is giving 255% movement speed bonus.
Quick as Thought gives 161% Global speed bonus!
Yes, Quick as Thought is even crazier than Blinding Speed, and it do not have any restriction at all.
Furthermore, it is stacking with Blinding Speed (Speed) and Haste (Haste) effects!
TW + Mindslayer Blinkwyrm with 480% global speed, 630% movement speed (passively) and 244% all action speeds? No random_boss_rarity talents are included.
These enemies can easily kill you in 1-2 turns, if you are unaware of them and you are careless.
yutio888 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 21, 2022 8:13 pmAI do lost your exact position if they cannot see you directly, even if you do not change position. In fact, AI always know your exact position in code, they just pretend to estimate your position with errors when you're out of sight or invisible. The errors start with 3 radius (unseen for 1 turn) and increases with the turns unseen, up to 10. You may check https://git.net-core.org/tome/t-engine4 ... I.lua#L237 for detail.
Some thoughts about Invisibility against casters:
Archmage has 24 damage dealing talents.
6 is a direct targeting spell (like Arcane Vortex, Freeze)
4 is a beam, so they can also miss with these.
2 is a smaller radius map effect AoE (Aether Beam, Aether Breach)
12 are huge radius AoE talents.
So, 50% of their damaging talents has a crazy huge radius.
Examples:
Flameshock, Mudslide: Radius 21 cones
Inferno is range 10 and radius 5 AoE
Fireflash is range 7 and a radius 17 AoE
Blastwave is radius 19 AoE, around the caster
Earthquake is range 10 and radius 11 AoE
Glacial Vapour is range 8 and radius 3 AoE
Tidal Wave is radius 10 AoE, around the caster
Frozen Ground is radius 19 AoE, around the caster
Shatter is "just" radius 10 AoE, around the caster
Nova is radius 14 AoE, around the caster
Illuminate is radius 23 AoE, around the caster
So, many of the spell/mindcaster enemies do not really care about
not knowing your exact location, just with a radius 3 error.
They have damage talents with radius 19 AoE, around the caster.
Radius 19+ AoE around the caster is like your full screen?
It does not even matter if they target the Fireflash into your opposite direction, becasue it has radius 17 AoE.
Btw, this also means: Mirror Image (and generally Taunting) is not effective against many classes.
Yes, they will target the Mirror Image with the radius 17 AoE Fireflash ...
But you are standing 4-6 tiles away from it.
Furthermore, most of the times, you are standing in a tunnel.
Or in a smaller area, like the Pride entrances.
So enemy will target you with a radius 3 error … in a 1-wide tunnel … with his range 21 cone … What do you guess: will it hit you?
I am playing with Anorithil for a while, and enemies just simply targeting me even with single target talents, while I am invisible and they have zero see_invisible…
yutio888 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 21, 2022 8:13 pmIn this run I'm playing in a way more based on luck, but this build is not very based on luck. Even if I'm doing mistakes and being careless occasionally, I still have some chance to win. I've just recorded two test plays in Gorbat Pride (https://youtu.be/Ox_VH3JHDGk and https://youtu.be/txQK3iiFOtc), playing in an extremely dangerous way, checking no talents info of enemies, fighting in blinded status, autoexploring many times, not putting too much attention on buffs and shields, and using teleport in uncleared levels. The first run I cleared most of the zone but fails to kill the boss and dies due to my carelessness, and the second succeeds.
This is really interesting to read. As far as i saw, you are continuously very lucky.
Not just with inventory, but with enemies too.
You are clearing Tier2 zones extremely quickly, before level 25, so you are not a Technomancer yet.
E.g.: you cleared the Sandworm Lair under ~52 minutes and you cleared the Old Forest under 40 minutes!
With my Anorithil, I cleared the Sandworm Lair under ~3 hours and 15 minutes and the Old forest under ~3 hours and 45 minutes!
At this early, there is not that huge difference between these classes according to damage output.
You have absolutely no real enemies.
I am continuously fighting with really tanky and crazy enemies, even from the very beginning.
If you are interested in any enemies / fights, I can send you the link(s).
- enemy_1.png (199.13 KiB) Viewed 10603 times
The dude was at the Rhaloren Camp, so in a Tier1 zone (I was level 16 here with my Sun Paladin).
It has: 9300 max life, Second Life, Timeless, Flash of the Blade, Wave of Power, Precise Strikes, Perfect Strike, Blinding Speed, Assault. It also has 122 weapon damage.
Btw, the dude has 3 different talents with random_boss_rarity.
And at this same level, there were 3 more totally crazy unique / boss too.
At the Tier2 zones, I am continuously fighting with these kind of enemies:
- enemy_2.png (116.46 KiB) Viewed 10603 times
You can see, both enemies have Precise Strikes and Blinding Speed (random_boss_rarity ...).
The Rogue, Summoner Bee had a 200% base global speed and extra global speed bonus from Speed effect, multi-attack talents, full Scoundrel tree, Grappling Hook, Smoke Screen (potential AoE silence) and crazy summons.
The Oozemancer, Summoner was also really crazy and I had to fight with it and with the Sandworm Queen together, at the same time.
I am continuously fighting with multiple Randboss / Unique Ruin Banshees, Dreadmasters in Dreadfell, I have met with Blinkwyrm in Dreadfell.
I was just Disperse Magiced in Dreadfell by a rare Archmage skeleton.
So, to make my point clear: 1.7.4 madness is winnable with MANY of the classes.
Even with an Alchemist.
Fixed bosses are not the real issue, and in ToME, random rare+ enemies and most things (items, inscriptions, map layouts & initial enemy placements...) are totally randomized.
But, the issue with most of the classes is: you have to be very very lucky continuously.
And because there are numerous zones and there are 1400+ rare+ enemies in the game,
- according to my experience - you cannot be continuously very very lucky.
If I am playing with an Alchemist and I am crazy lucky, like you: I am finding only those Randbosses/Uniques that are not that dangerous (e.g. Alchemist, Brawler wolf with staff), I am finding very strong items very early, I am finding good Shielding Runes early, a bit later good Stormshield Runes, so on … so I will just win the game.
You are saying, you have never met with an enemy with Purging Trap.
You have 3 madness wins, so you have killed around ~4500 rare+ enemies on madness only on these 3 runs. 3 classes can have Traps from the 33, so that means: 409 enemies could have Traps (Rogue, Archer, Skirmisher) from these 4500, on average. (Btw, MORE, because bosses / uniques have multiple classes)
How many Rogue, Archer, Skirmisher will have Traps? ~33% of them? Let’s say: only 20%. (I think, I said a low number, I guess it’s actually more)
409 x 0.2 = 81.
You are saying, these enemies only have a 6.6% chance to have Purging Trap: 81 x 0.066 = 5.3
So with average luck, you should have meet with ~5-6 of these dudes, so far.
yutio888 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 21, 2022 8:13 pmMany dangerous talents have less chance to appear compared to 1.6, like Disperse Magic, Corrupted Negation, Blinding Speed, etc... "random_boss_rarity" attribute is added in their definition.
This is true, but i can prove you with ~140 hours of video evidence, where I am inspecting enemies in 1.7.4: very high amount of enemies have random_boss_rarity talents.
Let’s just check 1 video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vScmrVzS1fg
At 00:04:38, you can see the “tooltip window” of the rare ghoul archer.
It has Precise Strikes.
At 00:35:07, you can see I am inspecting a rare Rogue time elemental.
The rare Rogue has: Rush, Perfect Strike, Blinding Speed.
Can you tell me: what is the chance to have 3 of this random_boss_rarity talents?
At 00:38:19, you can see the tooltip window of a rare Doombringer elemental.
It has Precise Strikes.
Ok, i am really interested in this one:
From 01:29:39 to 01:30:10, I am fighting with a Demonologist with ZERO see_invisible.
You can see, I was invisible with 26 power and the dude has 0 see_invisible.
I am Jumpgated to my first Jumpgate, then I Jumpgate to my second Jumpgate, so I was not stationary.
And after I Jumpgated the second time, the dude FEARSCAPED me, while I was invisible all the time.
Fearscape is a directly targeted talent, so it has to target the exact same tile where I am.
Can you explain me: how could the dude Fearscaped me, with zero see_invisible while I was invisible (26 power) and I was teleported two times, so I was not stationary?
You are saying, enemies have an error of radius 3 at first turn, then an increasing error radius for targeting invisible actors.
It Fearscaped me just after my second teleport.
At 01:31:34, you can see the tooltip window of a rare Berserker wolf.
It has Precise Strikes.
At 01:43:40, you can see the talents of a unique Rogue, Berserker.
It has Rush.
At 01:49:30, you can see the talents of a rare Naga Berserker.
It has Rush.
At 01:54:28, you can see the talents of a rare Brawler elemental.
It has: Rush, Precise Strikes and Perfect Strike.
At 02:36:48, you can see the talents of a randboss Bulwark, Gunslinger.
It has Rush and Precise Strikes.
At 03:04:05, you can see the talents of a unique Sawbutcher, Doombringer.
It has: Precise Strikes and Perfect Strike.
Fun:
At 02:58:21, you can see I am inspecting a rare Skirmisher.
The dude is anti-magic follower, because it has Purging Trap (Primed btw).
From 03:06:57, you can see how I got a Primed Purging Trap into my face.
The Skirmisher was Blinded and Confused (50%) and still throw in onto me.
I had 174% silence immunity totally, but still, I was:
Silenced for 7 turns, Dispersed, and Arcane Resource Burned.
And this is just one of my plays, just a 3 hours and 20 minutes of play.
I can accept that: you can play totally carelessly, you can auto-explore while you are also doing challenge run with your Archmages on madness. And you do not even checking the enemies at all. Ok.
But my personal experience is totally the opposite.
I am playing only on madness from 1.5.9 – 1.5.10 (apart from my East only Anorithil).
I have totally 200+ hours of play on 1.7.4 madness (~140 hours of this is recorded).
I just got a 7 turn long Silence with Disperse Magic into my face in Reknor, that bypasses Silence immunity and it’s a radius 2 AoE, and it is also a Disperse Magic.
What would happen with your Archmage if you got this at any of the Pride entrances, while you are fighting with several enemies? Or basically, anywhere at the late-game?
Instant death?
yutio888 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 21, 2022 8:13 pmHowever, my first cornac win in madness might be even luckier than this run: it was the first time I go to prides in madness in 1.7.4, and I didn't realized the difficulty of Gorbat Pride and went there very early, and got dispersed at the entrance with 2 blinkwyrms suddenly phase door inside. What I did to survive is Time Stop + Teleport + Movement Infusion + Stone Wall, and then I kept teleporting in the whole level and kiting many randbosses, barely managed to kill them. And in the final boss fight, I did not close the portals fast enough and get confused by some undeads, failed to action for 1 or 2 turns until my disruption shields broke leaving me very low hp, very lucky indeed to survive.
Congratulations for winning madness with your first mage that managed to reach the East.
So, as you described: you were also very very lucky with your other Archmages too.
I checked your Archmage characters:
You have this 3 Archmage wins on madness that you linked in your guide.
But I can only see 5 deaths with Archmages on madness.
All deaths are below character level 15.
This 37.5% winrate on madness is extremely good.
Grat!
What makes this Archmage build unkillable on madness after it reaches character level 15?
It seems, this Archmage is definitely stronger than a Possessor.
